[This story contains major spoilers from the finale of Washington Black.]

In the introductory narration of Washington Black, Sterling K. Brown’s character Medwin Harris presents the eight-episode drama as “a story about a young man and the boy he used to be. The story of a boy brave enough to change the world — unless it eat him up like it tries to do all of us, kill our hopes and spirits and everything we got. But if he can beat it, maybe we can too.”

Such is the Hulu adaptation of author Esi Edugyan’s 2018 novel of the same name, created by Selwyn Seyfu Hinds, who also serves as co-showrunner with Kimberly Ann Harrison. The series, set in the 1800s, follows an 11-year-old George Washington Black (Eddie Karanja) from the time he escapes from the plantation where he’s enslaved in Barbados through early adulthood where, after traversing the world in a hot-air balloon and a pirate ship, he finds community among free Black men and women in the Canadian capital city of Halifax. It’s there that young adult “Wash” (Ernest Kingsley Jr.) meets Medwin, a refugee who personally sees to his protection as he does the community at large, much like his former mentor John (Rick Worthy) did for him when he arrived in Nova Scotia. It’s that aspect of his character that Brown says makes him similar to that of another on his other Hulu series Paradise.

“Medwin in this way is kind of like Sinatra,” Brown tells The Hollywood Reporter in the conversation below about the character played by Julianne Nicholson in his other Hulu series, the twisty post-apocalyptic one that is currently filming its second season. “The thing that he has built is of the utmost importance to him and the idea that someone could destroy it is something that he can’t tolerate.”

That inability creates a dangerous distance between John and Medwin, much like the one that grows between Wash and Christopher “Titch” Wilde (Tom Ellis), the scientist who once saved him from certain death on the plantation only to abandon him halfway around the world.

Below, Brown and Kingsley Jr. talk with THR about their characters’ complicated relationships, framing the experience of formerly enslaved people through a whimsical lens and the hope that viewers don’t see the series as “luxuriating in our pain.”

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Sterling, I imagine you might’ve had your choice of character with this series as a producer. Why Medwin and how was he expanded in the series from the original novel?

STERLING K. BROWN [He was a] very small part in the novel. I think Selwyn saw the germs of something in terms of recognizing that Wash had different mentors throughout his life, whether it was Big Kit [Shaunette Renée Wilson], to Titch to Medwin. [The book] had a small mention in Halifax of someone that he met when he made his way up north and he decided to take that seed of a character and fully explore it a little bit more.

I’ll be honest, it was actually kind of a surprise. I was like, “I’m going to pass this off to this young buck. I’m going to have this show and it’ll be cool.” And they were like, “No, bro, you going to be in the show.” But I’m very, very happy and very proud to be in the show. There could have been other characters, like John, but it felt natural [to play Medwin] and it made sense. What I most liked about it is a Black American having this autonomy and freedom outside of America to create this world and village that I would imagine if he could have done so where he’s from in the south would have. He couldn’t do it until he got north of the border. I think about all of the townships, historically, that we have found, especially during Reconstruction, that were thriving communities full of beautiful Black faces, and for 12 years, which is the length of Reconstruction, we had a certain level of autonomy and then the country saw what it looked like and they were like, “No.”  We got a chance to actually be a part of and learn a lot from that Afro-Nova Scotian community in Halifax. It was a beautiful and heartwarming thing to be in the presence of, because we’d seen so many of our townships in the states go another direction.

Ernest, Washington sort of represents unlimited possibility in this narrative. What most drew you to the character and how did being in his shoes while filming affect you personally?

ERNEST KINGSLEY JR. It was the epic-ness of his journey. He goes on such a crazy adventure; I love characters who go through so much to then triumph over it in the end. It’s the level of perseverance and faith you have to possess, and it incites the same in me. How can I carry more of that dreaming, that faith, that ambition in my life? I feel like I’m someone who does have that, but Wash possesses this level of risk-taking that he will look adversity in the face and be like, “You know what? I choose love,” and “I’ll do it anyway.” I would love to carry myself with just a bit more “I choose love, I’ll do it anyway.” I think right now it’s like, “I choose love, but I’m going to keep it safe.”

We do see another side of Washington in the finale when he reconnects with Titch, and has a rather strong, negative reaction to the sight of him. What do you make of their reunion?

KINGSLEY JR. When I first read it, I was filled with so much bitterness, to be honest. I was like, “How could you leave him? How could you do those things?” But what surprises me, as Wash does again and again, is his level of grace. Even facing someone who has done so much to you and caused you so much hurt and pain in the past, you can still look at them and have a wealth of grace and, arguably, love towards them to still offer them something. It kind of took me off guard, to be honest. But it was something I held onto, like, wow, this character is incredible.

Similarly, Sterling, I want to ask you about Medwin’s relationship with John.

KINGSLEY JR. One of my favorite relationships.

BROWN It’s complicated.

Complicated is the perfect word. It’s such a heartbreaking scene when your character kills John, but learning his backstory was also really important. What do you feel John adds to the larger story?

BROWN You’re the first person to ask this question. This is a good one because it is a very deep and pivotal relationship, because John to Medwin is sort of Medwin to Wash, except John goes astray. And Medwin in this way is kind of like Sinatra [in Paradise]. The thing that he has built is of the utmost importance to him and the idea that someone could destroy it is something that he can’t tolerate. So the idea that somebody within that community could do something of harm, deliberately introduce people who mean nefarious things towards a young man willingly for money, for everything, it just sort of hurt his soul.

But the thing that’s even more [hurtful] is [Medwin] sort of introduced [John] to this coping mechanism to get over his own wife and children not being able to join him. So there’s this profound level of guilt and responsibility for sort of creating someone who would do this, and now having to rectify the situation. It sounds really strange. I never thought Medwin would be anything like Sinatra — but he’s not a monster.

KINGSLEY JR. I would disagree. I don’t think he’s anything like Sinatra, but fair enough.

BROWN In that situation and in that moment, because Ms. Angie [Sharon Duncan-Brewster] was like, “What did you do?” And you were like, “What did you do?” And I was like, “I did what I had to do.” Because [John] could no longer be trusted. If he was harmless, it’s one thing. I think for the longest time, [Medwin] just saw him as harmless. Even though it broke his heart to see him be a shell of himself, he wasn’t doing harm to anybody else in the community. But now he’s willingly introducing people into the community that can tear it apart. It’s always that tough decisions are made by the people who are at the top. Medwin has to make these decisions, where other people just have to live with the decisions that he makes.

I’m glad you brought up Sinatra because with Paradise you said you knew you were good with the show when Black women were on board. I’m curious for this one, who do you see as the target audience, and knowing that certain viewers may turn away because they’re tired of slave narratives, what do you say to presumptive critics?

BROWN We really worked long and hard to figure out how exactly to package the story in the way that pulled people in. I’ve listened to folks say the idea of luxuriating in our pain or trauma is passé. “We don’t need it.” “We don’t want it.” “We’ve seen it.” “We’ve been there.” I said, “I hear you. I see you. I think I have something different.” I don’t think we have to abandon stories that are tied to the institution of the trans-Atlantic slave trade, but we can highlight it in a different way.

I think through Washington Black, we see a young boy who transcends his circumstances, who allows his imagination, his hopefulness, his faith, his creativity to see and imagine a world beyond where he currently is. The lesson to me is that even now today, we have the power to see, to imagine, to hope for a reality that is greater than the circumstances that we find ourselves in, and we do not have to let circumstances dictate our opportunities or dictate what our future is. That’s what I hope we created, and we had to do a lot of creative things in order to make it that way in terms of non-linear storytelling, letting people know just how fantastical and whimsical and joy-filled this ride is. I hope they will ride with us. I really, really do.

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Washington Black is now streaming all episodes on Hulu. Read THR’s interview with co-showrunners Selwyn Seyfu Hinds and Kimberly Ann Harrison.